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  1. #1
    Coming Up The Ranks Oatmeal's Avatar
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    Default High Reps for increased Definition?

    Okay so I am planning on cutting now as I have already gained some quality muscle mass. I came across doug's 5 day high definition routine which has high rep sets. My question is why does a routine like this create more "definition" than say Steve's PMB or D4ds? In my knowledge being "shredded" is all about diet and cardio and the workouts remained very similar to your bulking workouts.

    This is strictly a question about the weight session, not the cardio or diet difference. I just want to know if I should be doing this routine for higher definition or sticking with 6-12 reps.
    Feel free to call me Chris.

  2. #2
    M&S Elite Member Kristian's Avatar
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    Personally I would stick to the 6-12 rep range. I think that if you increased reps to high say 20-25 there would be a higher chance of losing muscle and strength. I really dont know why the reps are so high because using high reps doesnt really bring out definition cutting bodyfat down does. Higher reps are just more suited for muscular endurance.
    Always put in 110% in everything you do so that when someone else shows up with 100%, you still got 10% on them.-Chidi Ekebere

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    Coming Up The Ranks Oatmeal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristian View Post
    Personally I would stick to the 6-12 rep range. I think that if you increased reps to high say 20-25 there would be a higher chance of losing muscle and strength. I really dont know why the reps are so high because using high reps doesnt really bring out definition cutting bodyfat down does. Higher reps are just more suited for muscular endurance.
    These are my thoughts aswell. I was just wandering what about this routine makes it claim the title of "High Definition" thats all.
    Feel free to call me Chris.

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    As Kristian said, but I recommend 1-8 max. In all honesty, I'd stick around the 5 rep range and work on heavy compound movements.

    Definition is almost solely dependant on body fat.

  5. #5
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    Higher reps full the muscle with blood which makes the muscle seem bigger. Ive seen guys only train in the 12-16 range with huge arms and chest, but then they go bench 70lbs dumbells for a 5x5 lol

  6. #6
    M&S Elite Member Kristian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oatmeal View Post
    These are my thoughts aswell. I was just wandering what about this routine makes it claim the title of "High Definition" thats all.
    Yeah, I wouldnt totally back off high reps though, they have their place in training. Low reps and high reps can both build muscle I just wouldnt switch to high reps while cutting.
    Always put in 110% in everything you do so that when someone else shows up with 100%, you still got 10% on them.-Chidi Ekebere

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach View Post
    Higher reps full the muscle with blood which makes the muscle seem bigger. Ive seen guys only train in the 12-16 range with huge arms and chest, but then they go bench 70lbs dumbells for a 5x5 lol
    Lol. My thoughts exactly; you should be able to be the part, not just look the part.

    When I went for my OHP 1RM, there was a guy and a chick - roided out like none other - who also happened to be doing OHP. The guys shoulders, and I **** you not, were the size of my head or bigger. He was hurting on 8-10x135. Mean while I'm off in the corner ****ing off with 195. Lol.

    Edit: BTW, and I am not kidding, the chick was pressing much better than him; indicating that she was a good bit stronger.
    Last edited by Mr. Shadow; 08-04-2010 at 04:19 PM.

  8. #8
    M&S Elite Member Kristian's Avatar
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    OHP = overhead press?
    Always put in 110% in everything you do so that when someone else shows up with 100%, you still got 10% on them.-Chidi Ekebere

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    Kettlebells' Angel !!!! 5kgLifter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristian View Post
    OHP = overhead press?
    Yeah

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    ^^^ What she said...

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    M&S Elite Member Kristian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5kgLifter View Post
    Yeah
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Shadow View Post
    ^^^ What she said...
    Gotcha, thats what I thought but just wanted to make sure.
    Always put in 110% in everything you do so that when someone else shows up with 100%, you still got 10% on them.-Chidi Ekebere

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    Yeah, I use a lot of abbreviations.

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    M&S Power User ssslayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oatmeal View Post
    Okay so I am planning on cutting now as I have already gained some quality muscle mass. I came across doug's 5 day high definition routine which has high rep sets. My question is why does a routine like this create more "definition" than say Steve's PMB or D4ds? In my knowledge being "shredded" is all about diet and cardio and the workouts remained very similar to your bulking workouts.

    This is strictly a question about the weight session, not the cardio or diet difference. I just want to know if I should be doing this routine for higher definition or sticking with 6-12 reps.
    1. If you would observe more closely - it also talks about the most important thing in bodybuilding = rest interval between sets. Playing around with it can make more impact that playing around with number or reps or sets.

    2. While cutting you have two things on mind: (a) I need to reduce the lard as fast and as much as possible. (b) I need to keep my muscles in a stage that they don't get fatigued and start losing out, but on the other hand they should be stimulated enough so that they are on maintenance levels, if not on increasing.

    3. You are on a reduced calorie diet - which means in any case you would find it hard to put on MORE lean muscles than what you have. Doing a regular heavy workout may cause you to burn out and consequently start losing muscles along with fat.

  14. #14
    Moderator Scrutiny's Avatar
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    Oatmeal -

    Routines in themselves do not create definition.
    "Definition" AKA fatloss is through the diet, calories in versus calories out primarily.

    The purpose of the weight training workout is to maintain the muscle mass you have.
    Lowering the weight and upping the reps would not be the best thing to do if your goal is to:

    A) Maintain as much hard earned muscle mass as possible
    B) Maintain as much hard earned strength as possible

    I believe one should cycle between high/low reps throughout the year, but when it comes down to cutting fat while wanting to maintain all that muscle/strength, keeping the weights significantly high will help you keep that muscle and strength.
    Consistency is the key

  15. #15
    Größte Mutter im Zimmer Abaddon's Avatar
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    completely agree. Whether you're looking to build muscle or strength, or just maintain, 15reps is absolute max I reckon.
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  16. #16
    M&S Elite Member Kristian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abaddon1 View Post
    completely agree. Whether you're looking to build muscle or strength, or just maintain, 15reps is absolute max I reckon.
    Unless your goal is related to muscular endurance or performance.
    Always put in 110% in everything you do so that when someone else shows up with 100%, you still got 10% on them.-Chidi Ekebere

  17. #17
    Trusted Advisor Doug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oatmeal View Post
    Okay so I am planning on cutting now as I have already gained some quality muscle mass. I came across doug's 5 day high definition routine which has high rep sets. My question is why does a routine like this create more "definition" than say Steve's PMB or D4ds? In my knowledge being "shredded" is all about diet and cardio and the workouts remained very similar to your bulking workouts.

    This is strictly a question about the weight session, not the cardio or diet difference. I just want to know if I should be doing this routine for higher definition or sticking with 6-12 reps.
    You are totally missing the point of the workout, that workout is one of a few that are posted on this forum by me that has been successful in cutting up prior to bodybuilding competitions.

    Remember a cutting diet/training for a competition is started approx 20 weeks out from a competition, the goal is to lose fat, retain all the muscle that has been previously built, and get on stage totally shredded with each muscle visable and striated.

    You can maintain and even build muscle with only 1-2 sets per muscle.

    Constantly training in a 6-12 rep range is best for "muscle building" and training in the 13+ rep range is into the "muscle endurance" range. But that doesnt mean you will lose muscle if you use the 13-15 rep range for a short period of time..if you also include in the routine sets that are within the "muscle building" range.

    Reps in the 13-20 range enable adaptations that are both metabolic and cellular which also allows hypertrophy in the mitrochondria and the blood capillaries. reps in the 9-12 rep range are metabolic and neural.

    Muscle is made up of cell structures, all taking up space in the muscle, this inlcudes the mitrochondria, myofibrils, sarcoplasm. Training in the 6-8 rep range will inclease myofibrillar hypertrophy and is what most class as muscle size. If you also want to target the mitrochondria and sarcoplasm, (which is also included in the actual muscle size) you should include training in higher rep ranges.

    If you have any doubt about high rep training not being used for muscle size you should look at the training of professional body builders who can fequently include high rep training, Tom Platz with his great legs was a great believer in his 100 rep squats sessions
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  18. #18
    M&S Power User ssslayer's Avatar
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    I think there is, quite clearly, a fear in ppl these days to undergo a high volume / high rep training (for even small durations).

    Ppl have a tendency to draw conclusions and pass judgments even before trying anything.

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    we alternate. couple months of 6-8 rep range with longer rest periods and a couple months of 8-15 reps with lots of supersets and trisets or bigger. rep range honestly has nothing to do with cutting. its all in your diet, as has been said. its about muscle fiber stimulation. period. also i agree, if youre cutting up and on reduced cals, no way in hell you'll be matching your big lifts. so rep what you get out and dropset/superset/etc like a mad man to keep your muscle tissue stimulated.

 

 

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